Wednesday, April 28, 2010
Oates and Mason
Both stories we read for this week - Bobbie Ann Mason's "Shiloh" and Joyce Carol Oates' "Where are You Going, Where Have You Been"- deal with romantic relationships and desire in very different ways. Both stories also share the trait of ambiguous endings. The audience is left wondering if Mason's Norma Jeane kills herself, and if Oates' Connie was raped at the end of the stories. Using evidence from the story, do you folks agree with these endings, or do you think something different happened to these women? I have my own opinions, and they don't necessarily mesh with the above endings. I'd like to know what you guys think. Make sure to use textual support in your answers!
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In the story Where are You Going, Where Have you been, I believe that in the end Norma Jean did kill herself. What I believe led her to this was because she no longer felt needed in her relationship. You can see you gets to this point because starts to become a body builder, which in case demonstrates how she is becoming part of a man in only supporting on herself. Her husband was a truck driver that was not around for most of the time. I think her mother too is treating her like she was a kid again, always on her case. You also see that she takes up an adult education class, simply because it was ‘something to do’ not because she wanted too, or wanted to start a career. It was just because it was something to keep her busy. But now I think she gets to a point where she just feels unwanted and her life is of no use. I think it is too late for her husband to try and save her, which is why I feel she kills herself in the end.
ReplyDeleteMeghan Viola
I do believe that Norma Jean kills herself at the end of the story. Norma is always working out and trying to build muscle which shows that she is taking on the roles of a man. Leroy on the other hand, takes on the roles of a women. Norma Jean is attending adult education while Leroy is at home building house kits for his future “log cabin.” Norma enjoyed the feeling of being free when Leroy was on the road and now that they are both together, Norma gets frustrated and wants him to get a job again. Their relationship worked better when they were apart. I believe Norma committed suicide to get away from her unhappy marriage. Connie may have gotten raped at the end because Arnold Friend kept indicating that she was his lover and only lover. Arnold friend had a sick mind and didn’t want anyone else but Connie. “I’m always nice at first, the first time. I’ll hold you so tight you won’t think you have to try to get away or pretend anything because you’ll know you can’t. And I’ll come inside you where it’s all secret and you’ll give in to me and you’ll love me.” (Oates, 985). This quote obviously indicates that Arnold wants to rape her. Connie has already given into him by obeying him and doing whatever he says so that her family doesn’t get hurt.
ReplyDelete-Amanda Bordiere
In the cases of both stories, the fates of both women, either suicide or rape, is never outright expressed as actually happening. While one could make that the argument for or against either event in the two stories, I believe that the implication of these such circumstances actually as a possibility is enough for the reader. What I mean is that although neither, one or both could have suffered the terrible fate that is hinted at, the fact that the reader even has the option to read it there own way is interesting. Evidence can be presented for both scenarios in either "Shiloh" and "Where are You Going, Where have You Been" with the ultimate determination being the way in which the reader perceives the outcome.
ReplyDelete-Will McMullan
I disagree with the thought that Norma Jean kills herself in Shiloh. I believe that the thought did cross her mind, but I don't think she actually did jump. She did live a hectic life with her mother babying her and bringing back past times and her husband who was rarely around to never leaving the house. I think she wanted to see if her husband did care about her as he watched her wave her arms. Norma Jean was not a happy-go-lucky person, and did many things to occupy her time instead of for her enjoyment. I don''t think Connie was raped in the end of "Where are you going, Where have you been", because I think Arnold either let her go or Connie just didn't try to fight him off. Both situations are awful and we are left with no answers as to what happens to the characters.
ReplyDeleteI agree with the first ending where Norma Jean kills herself in "Shiloh" because she is walking off into the light. I think that she is waving goodbye to her husband. She never got the chance to do what she wanted to do and did not like when her husband was around. I believe she jumped because she was not happy and did not want to take orders from her mother anymore. I also agree with the ending of "Where are you going, Where have you been. I believe that Connie was raped in the end because she left the house when she really was not forced too. She could have just stayed in the house or screamed for help it was the middle of the day. She could have avoided the outcome by not leaving the house.
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ReplyDeleteIn Shiloh, I do believe that Norma Jean did commit suicide because even to her husband Leroy, she appeared distant and unreachable. Yet I also believe that at the end of the story Norma Jean could have been calling Leroy over to ask him about trying to start a family again, since the author Bobbie Ann Mason adds two sentences that hint this. The first one, “some children run past him, screaming noisily”, and the second one “the color of the dust ruffle Mabel made for their bed.” both on 836, hint that the story could have had both a happy and a sad ending. In “Where Are You Going, Where Have You Been?” the author has some sentences that point out what really happens in the story. Similarly to Shiloh the story could have two endings, one where Connie is raped and one where she escapes from the house and leaves with a stranger. The first possibility is supported by the quote “she felt her breath start jerking back and forth in her lungs…” and the second possibility “so much land that Connie had never seen before and did not recognize except to know that she was going to it”. Yet, with so many references to rape throughout the story it is likely the ending is not a happy one.
ReplyDeleteStephen Denninger
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ReplyDeleteIn the story, Shiloh, I do believe that Norma Jean does kill herself because she can't take the fact that she has to live with her husband. When her husband workked she ewas free to do what she wanted without any questions asked. She can no longer do this. " They have known each other for so long they have forgotten a lot about each other." Also it become too much to live with someone who you don't know anymore. I also believe that she is tired of trying to meet everyone's expectations, her mother's and husband's. In my opinion, Connie does get raped at the end of the story. I think this because of all the sexual references and it the story itself is a typical rape set-up of man stalking girl, seducing her, taking advantage of her.
ReplyDeleteI agree with the end of "Where are you going, Where have you been". I believe that Connie was raped in the end because there was no need for her to actually come outside, especially after Arnold and his accomplice said the things they did. It still the middle of the day so she could have just stayed in the house or screamed for help. The entire situation could have been avoided if she wasn't so immature about her actions. I also believe Norma had killed herself in the story, Shiloh. Norma loved being free when Leroy was on the road for his job, but now that they are both always home together she begins getting mad and wants him to go back to work. Norma committed suicide to escape her bad marriage that evidently was only functional when the two weren't always around one another.
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